Wednesday, June 3, 2015

God "needs" us?

Excerpt from my book "HOW WELL DO I KNOW GOD"

12. God by His own design and choice "needs us" in order to experience Himself fully again.

There is also another vital change that occurred within the person (not the essence) of God by His design and choice. He purposely disrupted that complete and perfect union and love within the Trinity in order to allow others to enter into and participate in that glorious community which is God. The significance of this is that presently not all who will enter in have yet done so. Until those God has designed to join in His love enter in, the constant uninterrupted love He had from all eternity past is not at this present time complete in the same way it was prior to the incarnation and in some mysterious sense will continue incomplete until all God has designed to enter into that community do so. Why? Since God chose to share His love with us it was necessary for God to break the circle of love within the Trinity as children in a circle might unlock hands to allow others to join in and play. The necessity wasn’t from need but choice; a choice to share the overflow of joy and fullness of Himself with us. He did this freely, but He also did this really and truly. This was not some symbolic gesture but a real severing of something vital within His very being. (Otherwise why would Christ have cried out in agony, “My God, My God, why have your forsaken me?”) This was and is a real and true sacrifice by God the Father as well as God the Son. The very God of the universe gave up that which He valued above all things (His Son and the uninterrupted union, fellowship and community of His Son from eternity past along with the love and joy of it) in order that we might share in what He had (yes, He loves us that much!!!) and will again have; but in some mysterious way doesn't presently have in complete fullness at this time (though the union of the Father and Son has certainly been restored). Until all those that God intends to join in do so, His love is some inexplicable way will not be totally complete and whole again in the same way it was before the creation and the fall of man and will once again be throughout eternity. In short the circle of the Triune God is *not yet fully reunited and complete because it now includes those He has set His love on, who are not yet participating in that love. This full reunion is presently incomplete by God’s design and choice until all those He has set His love on have joined hands, so to speak, to reunite and complete that circle again. This is simply an extension of the loss God was and is willing to experience so that others might participate on the very Person of God.


  • *It could be argued that since the complete number of those who will eventually join in this union is already decided, the union is actually complete as far as God is concerned i.e. in His mind, however, just as something real in time occurred in the incarnation of Christ (though already complete in the mind of God) so too, those coming to Christ who have not yet come is a real occurrence as well. Since we are touching the fringe of the garments of the infinite; these thoughts are only a feeble attempt by a finite mind to grasp the infinite within the boundaries of scripture.

It may be argued that to insure this complete reuniting of the Godhead again there had to be a certainty of it occurring. Something of such magnitude and so fundamental to God’s being would not be left to chance. The surety of God’s “reunion” could only be guaranteed if it was determined that all who were intended to enter in to the community of God would in fact do so while at the same time giving those creatures real choice. This is an infinite concept of which the finite, you and I, cannot now fully grasp. A mystery of man's choice and God's choosing which we will not understand until eternity or possibly may never fully understand.

But even in our finite understanding there is God's design, and a reminder that we are not God or independent of God. These things humble us and require us to trust God in a way we wouldn't if we comprehended all things. And isn't this the heart of fallen man's dilemma? Isn't this the essence of pride and unbelief and even in part explains why He does not tell us everything? With every fiber of his being, fallen man resists having to be dependent on and totally, unconditionally trust God in all areas including our understanding of His ways.  In truth, the thought of not fully understanding these things scares us for it requires us to trust instead of control.

So there is a sense in which God presently acts out of need, but it is not a need for us but a need for Himself (you may wish to review my earlier section on God's "dependence" on himself). What makes God independent is the inter dependence of the Trinity. And it is the perfect giving and receiving of value/worth/glory within the Trinity that gives God the greatest joy and pleasure. But by His choice and design, He has temporarily disrupted that inter-dependence along with the complete fullness of the love and joy of it in order to allow others to share in it. And by our sharing in it we reflect back to God that love and glory that originates within Him alone. God was simply so happy, joyful, and full of love, that He longed for others to know and experience what He had been experiencing within the Godhead from all eternity. The overflowing joy, love and delight in communing and being united within His being. As a result He was willing to set aside for a time, the completeness of it so others could enter in to it. Now, the reuniting and the fullness of the flow of God’s love again, by His choice and design require our union with Him. So by His design we are now a part of His experiencing Himself fully and perfectly again. The end result is not just our rejoicing in Gods perfect and complete love but in His rejoicing in it again (“Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began) and our rejoicing in it along with Him. This will be the ongoing celebration throughout eternity beginning at the wedding feast of the Lamb.

The wonder of God’s perfect plan is truly beyond our understanding. Praise Him for He is full of wonder! To Him be all worth and majesty both now and for all eternity, for from Him, through Him, and to Him are all things. To Him be the glory!

In summary when we think about how God made us exactly as we are so we would best be able to commune with Him; to love Him and to be loved by Him most, we had to be like Him as much as possible while at the same time still dependent creatures. And the way man turned out from the creation to the fall to procreation and our present state of rebellion (a choice) with all the suffering and pain it has caused is all part of God’s perfect overall plan to bring about our greatest possible union with Him and His greatest possible glory. This is God’s plan; that we might know and experience Him as He experiences Himself as much as possible for created beings to do so. In order for that to occur I would suggest every aspect of how things have occurred and will occur is the deliberate design of God toward that end. Nothing is an accident or by chance, but deliberate and purposeful. Every aspect of how we were created, our ability to doubt God, to rebel, fall, and the consequent suffering to mankind and the rest of creation were all necessary and intentional, to satisfy this overriding purpose for our existence, which is for as many as possible to be conformed to the image of His Son as much as possible in order that we come to know and experience all that God is to the greatest extent possible thereby glorifying Him. In short man’s rebellion and fall along with the consequent pain and suffering and God’s redemption of man was not God’s backup plan to a messed up original plan but was the original plan from eternity past in order for God to achieve this end. All things occur in order for us to enjoy and appreciate God in all His love, joy, splendor and glory to the greatest degree possible. Of course this is only the reasoning and speculation of a finite mind within the boundaries of scripture and no doubt falls far short of grasping the fullness of one of the greatest mysteries of God.